Dido

How do we stay Wesleyan if we don't heed the Notes and Sermons of John Wesley in some way

You need to not preach your personal theology but preach the theology of the church

United Methodists are not supposed to contradict the church's doctrinal standards, but can "go beyond and expand

Wesley believed that the doctrine of the Trinity of Father, Son and Holy Spirit was a "fundamental belief" of Christian faith

Believing in the "complete divinity" of Christ was also "essential" to Christianity

Wesley thought there was "nothing of greater consequence" than the doctrine of atonement. Without belief in the atonement, religion becomes merely deism, Wesley feared

Wesley did not insist on "any particular understanding" of the atonement, but emphasized that "salvation was based on the whole life of Christ."

Wesley was committed to the traditional Protestant doctrine of Scripture alone as the final authority for the church

Wesley leaned on Eastern Orthodox traditions by stressing that we are "liable for own sins, not the sins of our parents."

Wesley affirmed and thought essential was justification by faith alone, Wesley's emphasis was slightly different because he insisted that faith cannot mean only assent but must engage the heart and affections.

Wesley's seventh essential doctrine was regeneration through the "new birth," Campbell said. Methodism's founder warned against leaning on the "slender read of baptism," when salvation required being born again. Belief in the possibility of entire sanctification beyond regeneration was a distinguishing mark of Methodism, though Campbell said Wesley did not make that an essential Christian doctrine.

United Methodism, "We are a church with clear doctrine. It shapes our practice in ways we don't know."

Bishop Jones said Campbell's description of Wesley's theological "distinctions" was "wrong" because Wesley believed there should be nothing distinct about Methodism. Wesley asserted he was preaching "just the religion of the Bible."

"Every time he [Wesley] lays out Methodist beliefs he's saying it's basic Christianity," Jones said. Wesley was determined to preach "primitive Christianity" and to rescue the faith from "more corrupt forms." Jones asserted Wesley would include holiness and sanctification on his list of important doctrines. Smiling, Jones also told Campbell, "You got through the whole lecture without talking about [grace]!"

Jones suggested that the understanding of God as love should be counted among Wesley's essential doctrines. While the Reformed tradition emphasized God's sovereignty, Wesley instead insisted on the primacy of God's love.

Regarding justification by faith, Jones questioned whether Campbell was not ascribing to Wesley "too Lutheran an interpretation."

"Luther was confused on this," Jones said. "Wesley said Luther was ignorant of sanctification," Jones noted. "But Roman Catholicism was often ignorant of justification." Wesley believed that it had "pleased God to give the Methodists a clear understanding of both," Jones observed.

Wesley believed that works are not necessary "directly" for salvation but are necessary for the "continuance of faith," Jones said.

Responding to Jones, Campbell said Wesley did "claim a distinctive task" for Methodists in some cases that set the Methodists apart from the rest of Christianity. In some cases Wesley professed to believe only in the "old doctrines." But the evangelist also believed that Methodists had "special gifts" and a "unique mission."

Campbell explained, in response to Jones's query, that Wesley's understanding of grace was embedded in his doctrine of original sin, which emphasized the universal need for God's mercy.

Jones recalled Wesley saying he came within a "hair's breadth" of Calvinism. Wesley was shaped by Puritanism and shared in John Calvin's "strong emphasis on grace." But Calvin believed in double predestination, while Wesley believed in the possibility of universal redemption.

Presbyterianism lost its debates with Wesleyan Arminianism in the early 19th century, Jones said. Now Presbyterians usually function as Arminians. But Jones said they want to "remember Calvin" instead of remembering Charles Finney, the 19th century Presbyterian evangelist who stressed the universal appeal of the Gospel.

Jones pointed out that Wesley "raised the bar" as to what a Christian really is by insisting on the "individual experience" of conversion instead of merely baptism or membership in a state church. In doing this, Wesley gave "self worth" to the lower classes, who flocked to early Methodism. Jones suggested the birth of the Wesleyan movement should be traced not to Wesley's Aldersgate conversion experience but to the day in 1739 when he first preached in an open field to 3,000 people.

Campbell compared Wesley's beliefs about conversion to the Puritans who influenced him. The Puritans believed in an assurance of salvation, as Wesley would, but they believed that sanctification was a process of growth and holiness that does not culminate in this life. In contrast, Wesley emphasized the possibility of sanctification in this world.

Wesley understood the claims of the Methodist movement to be common Christian teachings, Campbell acknowledged. But though Wesley did not see Methodist teachings as distinctive, he saw Methodism as a "distinctive apostolate," or unique association, within the wider church.

Both Campbell and Jones agreed that Methodism claims apostolicity. But Campbell disagreed with Jones about Methodism claiming catholicity. "We don't represent the fullness of the faith," Campbell said. "My belief is that catholicity is found in the ecumenical church," he added. "And we're incomplete without the communion of other churches.

Jones replied that "too many believe there's a huge jump from the Apostles to Wesley without realizing how much Wesley borrowed from those who went before." Wesley thought religious experience was the goal of sound doctrine.